gridlore: Doug looking off camera with a grin (Me - Desk)
[personal profile] gridlore
Dear Third Imperium,

It's not you, it's me. I know, we've been together for over thirty years, but I've grown in that time and you? Well, let's be honest. You're still rehashing things that were first published decades ago, trying to make them look shiny in new editions. I remember when we first met. Adventure 1: The Kinunir. How young we were! How naive! The Imperium had Senators? 1200dt was a battle cruiser? Oh, the fun we had! And the fun went on, for a time, but then things started turning. Although I didn't see it at the time, you were already stagnant, already crippled by your inability to grow. You promised me epic games of exploration, and what did I get? A default setting surrounded on all sides by long-established cultures, not a frontier in sight!

What's worse is how mundane you made everything. I'm capable of getting on a plane and going to any number of paces on this planet where the language, culture, religion.. all of it changes and is fascinating. But you, given thousands of star systems and dozens of alien races and variant humans, distill everything down to a pale vanilla. Why travel, when every world is the same? Then there are your alleged "threats." Yes, I'm bitter. Remember the barbarians from the original Battle of the Two Suns? They became the evil Zhodani.. but you couldn't leave well enough alone and hemmed and hawed until Zhodani society began to look a damn slight better than Imperial society did! You emasculated the big threat in the setting! What else did you have? The Vargr? Established that they couldn't organize enough to be a threat. The Aslan? For some reason this allegedly fractious band of clans has saw fit not to launch any kind of attack for several centuries. The Solomani? Dime-store fascists still plotting to get their capital back. The Hivers? Clever idea, but badly executed. And the one race that should have been launching million-ship, epic space opera, damn we need a hero now, crusades against human space, the K'kree, seemed content to trade with species that we were told represented absolute evil in their mindset. A K'kree wouldn't trade with a human just because that particular human stuck with a vegan diet for a month. Humans are g'naack! We eat meat, and deserve to die! The Imperial Navy and Marines should have been locked in a centuries-long war against the unending hordes from K'kree space! But no, they - and you - wimped out.

What's that? "The Rebellion"? Don't make me laugh. First of all, competing factions fighting over the throne is not a rebellion, it's a civil war. Had Dulinor attempted to leave the Imperium, that would have been a Rebellion. But even then you failed. It took about seven books before somebody realized that wars suck, and released Hard Times. Too little, too late. Traveller: TNE failed because instead of a frontier, it gave us established settings that hadn't really fallen that far. Marc Miller's Traveller could have been good, but you filled up too many worlds with space faring cultures! Again, no damn frontiers!

So the time has come, Third Imperium. I've found a new universe. The GrimDark future of Warhammer 40k. I'll admit we've been flirting for a while now, but having read several of the novels (something you never bothered to do more than half-heartedly) and read the rules for Dark Heresy, I'm leaving you. WH40K gives me what I need, endless variety, conflicts with a real bite and reason, adventure possibilities up the wazoo, and with warp storms and the variable nature of the immaterium, frontiers opening up constantly. Aliens that are truly alien, and an over-arching foe in Chaos that can drive campaigns for years. A living universe teeming with culture, flavor, and opportunities for desperate struggles to win fame, fortune, and the future of mankind.

Good luck with the updated material from the 80s.

Douglas Berry, aka Sir Arameth Gridlore
Master and Commander of the Free Rogue Trader Estimated Prophet

Well...

Date: 12 Sep 2010 03:22 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] zakueins.livejournal.com
First of all, I think they did pull off a pretty good version in GURPS Traveller. The rest did kind of blow big biomatter chunks.

I'm glad to see something close to my dreams in Rogue Trader, only wish it wasn't so GrimDark...

If tomorrow morning you could write the Traveller of your dreams, what would it be?

Re: Well...

Date: 12 Sep 2010 06:50 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] dalen-talas.livejournal.com
... WH40K can be done in a completely non-GrimDark fashion. Just read the Ciaphas Cain novels.

Re: Well...

Date: 12 Sep 2010 13:32 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
As Dalen Talas pointed out, you can easily brighten up the setting.

I've posted two (http://gridlore.livejournal.com/1330708.html) variant (http://gridlore.livejournal.com/1510261.html) Imperiums. Either of those would have been better than the OTU in my opinion. I also would have made the Zhodani more evangelical about spreading the joys of their telepathic mind-control paradise.

Date: 12 Sep 2010 03:27 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shadowcat48li.livejournal.com
I'm not quite ready to completely cross to 40K, but I agree on a lot of your points, please keep us informed on your 40Kish ramblings...

Date: 12 Sep 2010 03:29 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shadowcat48li.livejournal.com
if I was to take a set non traveller sf gaming universe to re-engineer for traveller, two come to mind, The Merchantile League from Space Opera, or a very modified version of the Battletech universe sans mecha

Date: 12 Sep 2010 13:36 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
I loved the Battletech setting, and owned all the original House books. I particularly liked the Free Worlds League.

A lot of the Space Opera setting guides were good, and remain useful for idea looting.

Date: 12 Sep 2010 16:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shadowcat48li.livejournal.com
Phil McGreggor who worked on Space Opera also worked on Traveller, and Bob Charette worked on Space Opera and Battletech


odd what if thought.. what could Michael Stackpole have done with a traveller novel?

Date: 12 Sep 2010 05:20 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] melchar.livejournal.com
Great letter and valid complaints. Lo I recall the first days of Traveller, when I was deciding which game to referee - Traveller or Space Opera. To be honest waaaay back then I went with Space Opera because I heard Traveller was planning to put out 'several' more booklets .... and I wanted to go with the option that let me design the universe more to my liking. ^_^

... and I -love- the name of your ship!

Date: 12 Sep 2010 13:40 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
You get the reference (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzOyHuRzzq0), yes?

Date: 12 Sep 2010 08:04 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cmdr-zoom.livejournal.com
Isn't 40K's setting just as static, however? A more dynamic and chaotic equilibrium, yes - much like modern theories suggest of what we once considered boring, empty vacuum - but ultimately unchanging. Things have been the way they are for millennia and will continue to be so as far as we can foresee. There is little or no technological or social change, little hope for the future beyond another day's survival; only war, war without end. (By the grace of the Emperor, amen.)

Date: 12 Sep 2010 13:48 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
But as I pointed out, there's far more variation inside that setting. The WH40K Imperium is gigantic, you could have a campaign that burned dozens of worlds, toppled civilizations, and culminated in a battle involving several chapters of Space Marines and a million Imperial Guard versus the hordes of Chaos and it would still be a local event, barely noticed outside the sector it happened in.

A good comparison is Iain Bank's Culture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Culture) in terms of scale and reach.

Date: 12 Sep 2010 16:03 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shadowcat48li.livejournal.com
and theres plenty of room for minatures battles, especially with the epic scale rules, epic scale is roughly 1/300th. so you could use other vehicle minatures etc too

Date: 12 Sep 2010 16:15 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] shadowcat48li.livejournal.com
Doug could you please re-post the song about traveller to the tune of American Pie, or just a link to it?

Date: 13 Sep 2010 21:05 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
The Traveller Saga
by Douglas & Kirsten Berry
music: "American Pie" by Don McLean

A long, long time ago,
I can still remember how the first game stirred my soul
Known Space on the StarForce map
A handfull of stolen dice and that
Was all it took to make my dreams take flight

Every weekend at the game store
With my ten hard-earned bucks to buy some more
Now twenty years have flown past
With wars and life and mishaps
I know I'm not that wide-eyed teen
But I still look up and I still dream
Whatever comes I do believe
I still will play this game

(Chorus)
So bye bye, I'm goin' Travellin' tonight
The rules set may be changing
But the concept's all right
And it lets me travel through the stars and through time
Saying: Gonna play this game 'til I die
Gonna play this game 'til I die

Do you remember when CT
Was only Books 1,2, and 3
and a homespun setting that you wrote
Do you recall Bill and Andrew Keith
Early FASA and JG [3]
All the products out to help us play
And slowly the Imperium came to light
With enemies for us to fight
Then in Supplement 3
We First met the Zhodani
It was a glorious time of change and growth
And we couldn't ever get enough
So we sat down and wrote our own stuff
And I still played this game

I told my mother...
(Chorus)

Then came some folks called DGP
About as passionate as you or me
About this universe we'd made
They filled in all the holes and cracks
They fixed some rules, they wrote a patch
And changed the way the game was played
But GDW had a plan
Strephon died at an assassin's hand
The Imperium fell to war
Much worse than before
And in '87 we got MT
To play through this galactic catastrophe
But the new rules didn't mean much to me
'cause still, I played the game

I told my girlfriend.
(Chorus)

For six years, we played through Hard Times
While pretenders fled and planets died
And we wondered how it all would end
Then we got the horrid news
About a Virus that would use
Any means to kill humaniti
TNE made its bright debut
While the Old Timers hissed and booed
Much dissent was spoken
The TML was broken!
And while X-Boat waxed on days gone by
GDW up and died
The hard core fans sent up a cry
They can't have killed our game

They told their children...
(Chorus)

Then Marc Miller took back control
And promised Traveller like we had before
But did they try to push too fast?
For T4 was a sorry mess
Barely edited and the rest
Of the releases, well they didn't shine much more
The authors grumbled we've not been paid
Imperium Games quietly sped away
Then Loren brought our reprieve
A deal with Evil Steve
A return to all those Classic themes
Of hard-sf and future dreams
It may be GURPS, but what the beans?
I still will play this game

We'll tell our grandkids...
(Chorus)

(slowly)
Now twenty years and more have past
From first edition to the last
But the setting is the game to me
I went down to my local store
Where I bought the first books years before
But that store now is part of history
And nowadays the kids play Magic
Glitterboys or Vampires tragic
No more the sound of parties-
Instead, the hum of PCs
And books for which I once did lust
Sit on the shelf collecting dust
But I have them and that's enough
For still, I play this game

(Chorus, slowly)

(Chorus)


Date: 12 Sep 2010 16:35 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] crankyoldgoat.livejournal.com
hence my use of the infrastructure implied in the rules rather than the setting.

always been an Imperium free zone.

Date: 13 Sep 2010 19:54 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] allen shock (from livejournal.com)
Left Traveller myself. I am now running Thousand Suns when I run "Imperial science fiction". Dark Heresy was too dark for my crowd but the universe is way cool. I am slowly piecing together my own setting for TS and I like the gam way better than even the current iteration of Traveller.

Date: 13 Sep 2010 20:56 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
I really enjoy TS as well, and had a hand in it's creation (one guess what section I contributed.) The d12 system is a bit clunky, but serviceable.

But the problem...

Date: 14 Sep 2010 19:22 (UTC)
From: (Anonymous)
...is that I cannot think of WH40K without THIS (http://media.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/image/hello-kitty-40k.jpg) image popping into my head....

Re: But the problem...

Date: 14 Sep 2010 23:27 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
So? This image is the basis of my entire campaign! Ordos Badtz-Maru of the Inquisition!

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gridlore: Doug looking off camera with a grin (Default)
Douglas Berry

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