gridlore: Doug looking off camera with a grin (M-16)
[personal profile] gridlore
The Homeland Security Act is the scariest thing to come down the pike in the United States in a very, very long time. You can read about it here.

What can we do? Write your Congress-critters. Do not email them. Email gets ignored. Whip out the word processors and put your words on paper. Calling them also gets registered.

If it does pass, use cash whenever possible. Especially when you buy ammo for the weapons we should all own before the 2004 election season. The Second Amendment is the reset switch on the U.S. Constitution.

Date: 15 Nov 2002 08:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nsingman.livejournal.com


Nicely put.

Date: 15 Nov 2002 11:07 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tavella.livejournal.com
The Second Amendment is the reset switch on the U.S. Constitution.

Nicely put.


Interesting. I regard it as a terrifying threat. My freedom of speech. Reset. My freedom from religion. Reset. My right to vote. Reset. The rights of my friends not to be slaves. Reset.

The only reset button the Constitution requires is already contained within itself.

Date: 15 Nov 2002 16:55 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] gridlore.livejournal.com
My freedom of speech. Reset.

The current Attorney General has stated, on record, that criticizing the President should be a punishable offense.

My freedom from religion. Reset.

Read up on Tom DeLay, now the number 2 man in the House of Representatives. Not only does he not want you to be free from religion, he wants to choose your faith for you if he doesn't like your choice.

My right to vote. Reset.

If you live in Broward County, Fla, it appears to be happening already. Hundreds of thousands of ballots vanished on election night. All from heavily Democratic districts.

The rights of my friends not to be slaves. Reset.

Under the emergency legislation passed by Congress after 9/11, you can be arrested as a terrorist suspect, and held without charges, the right to an attorney, any visitors.. anything, for as long as the government feels like holding you. This is already happening.

The only reset button the Constitution requires is already contained within itself.

And when the Government ignores that Constitution? What then?

Have you read the Declaration of Independence? I mean really read it? We didn't break away from the mother country on a whim. We had a specific list of abuses that were enumerated clearly. If the colonists hadn't been armed, nothing would have happened.

Remember, this is the same Bush administration that came up with the great idea of having your postal worker reporting on you.

Date: 16 Nov 2002 14:47 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] nsingman.livejournal.com
I think you may be interpreting "reset" as "erase," rather than as "restore to original settings."

Date: 17 Nov 2002 16:35 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
Not really...

Merely a reassertion that the Government governs at the pleasure of the people and not the other way around.

At that point, depending on the beliefs of the people asserting that power, the Constitution would most likely be revised.

Given the general beliefs that seem to be at odds with the current governmental bent and the general agreement with the Constitution as written, a "minor" revision vs. a complete overhaul seems more likely and would be easier to ratify.

Probably a revision that restricted the Federal government more from certain privacy and personal protection areas (civil rights, that sort of thing) and hopefully a more simplified plain language version...

Date: 18 Nov 2002 10:02 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] cmdr-zoom.livejournal.com
"The People have lost the confidence of the Government; the Government, therefore, has elected to dissolve the People and to appoint a new one."

(1) You're assuming that the tenor of the government does not accurately reflect the will of the people. However, if the recent election results are at all representative, it DOES ... unfortunately with those who happen to disagree with the majority.

(2) Something written in plain language, by lawyers? A profession whose very existence depends on knowing more of the Sekrit Lore than you do? Ha. Ha ha.

Re:

Date: 18 Nov 2002 10:56 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
Considering the minority that have enough confidence in or care enough to bother about the government...

...Besides, we are a Constitutional Republic and not a straight Democracy.

The point of which is to insure the rights of those not in the voting majority.

(The whole point behind ennumerated Constitutional Rights, the Electoral College, the Senate vs. House designs, the appointment of Senators early on in lieu of direct election, the Supreme Court and Appeals Courts, etc.)

Enough of a "minority", or a grouping of such, can force the issue and protect their interests with the rest forced to either fight and kill them and risk their own skins or to accede and let them either go their own way or change the Constitution accomodate their concerns.

Admittedly, the last time this happened in large scale, the "minority" lost after a number of bloody years.

Most votes doesn't always mean right.

Bread and circusses and all that.

Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 15 Nov 2002 08:17 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-ogre.livejournal.com
...that I'm buying one of these (http://www.smith-wesson.com/templates/large.cfm?stdImage=629CL_163638.jpg&model=629%20Classic) from a coworker, it definitely makes me a bit happier that I've decided to get back into shooting now, instead of waiting some more.

Re: Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 15 Nov 2002 10:55 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
But can you get it in a "LS" model?

Sorry...

Why not just get a nice carbine or rifle and skip the wrist trauma?

*smirk*

Re: Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 16 Nov 2002 12:18 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firestrike.livejournal.com
Because...

As a pistol, it's slightly more portable/concealable. (Yes, you can put a carbine under the driver's seat, but it takes too long to get it out to do any good.)

Long arms draw more attention.

Even in these times of uncertainty & paranoia, a handgun is not sufficient reason to call out the SWAT team, whereas a rifle may be, especially if the idiot reporting it can't tell a Winchester '73 from an AUG.

Lastly, if you get it with a nickle finish, you can use it as a signal mirror if you get lost

Re: Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 16 Nov 2002 14:44 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
Lastly, if you get it with a nickle finish, you can use it as a signal mirror if you get lost

*smirk*

Good one.

My only quible is, when you need a gun and have a choice, there's nothing like a rifle or carbine.

(OK, the new Mk 46 Mod 0 looks nifty, but it's not something a civilian can get.)

And, if you don't need a gun, why waste the energy hauling around a hog leg like that?

I mean, if you live in bear country or PCP is the local drug of choice...

Then again, this looks vaguely appealing in a non-sniper-looking/non-assault rifle looking way:

Image

Hmmm... Needs an intermediate eye-relief scope on a Picatinny rail where the rear sight is, and a protected ghost ring rear...

...and maybe a ported barrel.

Re: Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 17 Nov 2002 15:51 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-ogre.livejournal.com
"Why not just get a nice carbine or rifle and skip the wrist trauma?"

Um.. 'cuz I like like big, macho revolvers. And I've got pretty freakin' strong wrists.

And this particular 629 has a very nice pistol scope currently mounted. And I'm gettin a fantastic deal for it.

Re: Though it's not the primary reason...

Date: 17 Nov 2002 16:25 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
Still...

From a capabilities point-of-view...

Unless you have only one hand, need to conceal it, can not end up facing targets beyond about 10m, or require both hands before or after use...

...Why risk it?

For target shooting or hunting non-dangerous game or as back-up weapon while hunting dangerous game), I can understand.

For anything else...

*shrug*

I like to err on the side of caution, saving my meager good karma for what I can't control...

*grin*

Although...

If you decide to go for a hand cannon anyway and can get a good price for it, go for it.

From a capabilities point-of-view...

Date: 17 Nov 2002 17:49 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] firestrike.livejournal.com
I prefer a grenade launcher.

Granted, it doesn't have the range of a good rifle. But if a sniper is out to get me, I'm probably dead anyway. For point-blank to medium range situations, it's versatile & effective.

As far as the usefulness of a pistol:

1. Ignoring conventional combat situations, most shootings occur within 10m anyway.

2. In the case of this particular weapon, if you're empty and desperate, you can throw it at your opponent. If it hits him, he's probably out of action.

3. It makes a great paperweight.

Seriously, the main reason to carry a sidearm is for situations where you need concealed carry capability, to keep a hand free for other activities, or when you're going to be working at short range or in an enclosed space.

-M

Re: From a capabilities point-of-view...

Date: 17 Nov 2002 18:00 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] the-ogre.livejournal.com
Well, I am getting it for target shooting. I certainly won't be packing this thing anywhere, nor do I expect to use it for "home defense" - that's what riot batons are for.

I am buying it, and the scope and cool-looing but uncomfotable grips will come off as soon as I get it home. Once I get comfortable with it at pistol distances, I'll probably reattache the scope and see what it's like at long-gun distances.

Re: From a capabilities point-of-view...

Date: 17 Nov 2002 20:40 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] todkaninchen.livejournal.com
That last bit sounded famliar...

*smirk*

Date: 15 Nov 2002 14:33 (UTC)
From: [identity profile] janetmiles.livejournal.com
You might also be interested in this article (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=6250), about the "16-page Cyber Security Enhancement Act (CSEA) slipped into into the Homeland Security bill at the last moment".

I'm still not quite ready to predict the end of civilization as we know it, but I'm getting less and less happy with each passing day.

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gridlore: Doug looking off camera with a grin (Default)
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